In the past, even transphobic people called trans people the right pronouns and gender anyway...

boston police department (bpd)

kek

People used to dislike trannies because of ignorance, now they dislike trannies because of familiarity. That is the difference.

Acktchually, people who know at least 1 tranny IRL are less transphobic than people who don't know any.

People who hate trannies usually see a tiny handful of carefully handpicked viral news stories and some ugly pictures of pre-everything girls on transition support forums

The conservative movement lost so much ground on cis gay rights that they’re trying to reverse course with trans people. So you’re right that it’s worse now, but I take some comfort in the fact that it’s not natural. It’s the result of very deliberate effort by people who will not be able to keep this up forever, and just like the scaremongering toward non-hetero cis people, eventually more people are going to start wondering if what trans people want is so bad or such a big deal.

The problem is that a lot of this is fueled by internet astroturf campaigns, something we have no historical precedent for. So we have no idea whether this will peter out or continue as everyone becomes more and more terminally online.

I feel like you're coming from a different universe than me. All media with trans people tended to have people switch from female pronouns to male pronouns when they discovered the trans person was trans and noone would even bat an eye at it. The trans person was often just there for ridicule. Really the only exception I can think of is Always Sunny (where the trans woman is ridiculed but you're supposed to think the Gang is pathetic for it). Mainstream acceptance was incredibly low it's just people were quiet about it because they mostly didn't think about us at all
Anon Babble was pretty trans positive back then but mostly because they saw us as a luxury kind of porn or because there eas sort of a joint understanding that everyone on Anon Babble were failed males in one way or another.
It's because a propaganda campaign started the second Gay marriage was one because conservatism requires people to be scared of their neighbors and once gay marriage was one at a Supreme Court level they realized that was a losing battle and needed a new scapegoat.

This is what trannies like to tell themselves yes but the trans movement is rotten and has been for a decade. A terminal case of the modern identity politics unfortunately. Nobody is making trannies look bad besides trannies, they're only making sure everyone gets to see it.
Trannies made sure there would be no good faith discussion by employing fascistic bully tactics because they were told they could just win like that and everyone supported them, now they're suffering the consequences of that and their allies are throwing them under the bus.
Cope if you like but trannies have not been incorrectly portrayed, they're scapegoats for a reason, and it is this attitude that perpetuates the problem.

This is what trannies like to tell themselves yes

That is what has been shown. Across the political spectrum, if you know a trans person you are more sympathetic. The worst trannies are usually deeply troubled neurotic sadsacks, more likely to trauma dump than uhhh "fascist bully" you

Most trannies are not using "fascistic bully tactics" IRL. You're probably referencing some assholes on twitter saying "punch terfs" or whatever, and they definitely exist....but they are fighting back against nonstop conservatives who are using "fascistic bully tactics" and actually have the power of the state to back them up.

the modern identity politics

Modern identity politics is constant right wing grievance seeking and shit stirring. Sorry if you faced minimal pushback on this from the people you seek to destroy

You’re absolutely right that I’m comparing eras of politics where the internet was in a drastically different state, and that has had a major impact on what anti-trans propaganda can be spread and its result.

But the state of internet regulation is not fixed, and neither is the average person’s relationship to internet use. We got to where we are now because social media has been under-regulated and under-moderated. A law (or even just a TOS update or two to stave off pressure for a law) could change a lot of this.

And there’s already a social stigma around using the internet too much, in the simple fact we have the expression “terminally online.” There’s also only going to be more research, evidence, and messaging from experts to the effect that too much internet is bad for you.

These are dynamic factors that can change over time.

Modern identity politics is constant right wing grievance seeking and shit stirring. Sorry if you faced minimal pushback on this from the people you seek to destroy

I'm willing to blame liberals and conservatives a like desu. I think the libs love when the right wing bullies us because then they can dangle rights like a carrot on a string but when they're in power right executive orders that are basically strongly written letters. Everyone in power is happy when we're arguing about identity because then we're not talking about class

Never said I was right wing but thanks for proving my point.
Every issue that trannies look bad for now have the same formula. A decade ago people were open to discourse on them, trannies said "no compromise we get what we want or you're a transphobe" , they allowed and proctected extreme views from within their own community that they didn't agree with, and now the vast majority of people do not like them.
These issues include

gender affirming care and minors

bathrooms/gendered spaces

woman's sports

pre-sex disclosure

I have no skin in the game, I don't care if you want to keep coping and telling yourself that you're the victim of some grand conspiracy, you're a victim of your own actions and your inability to learn from your mistakes, and priding yourself on that exactly.

victim of some grand conspiracy

It is not a conspiracy to say the openly known fact that right wing politicians have paid for ads that shit talk us for 8 years straight and it's clear you devoured them up as you copy their language and logic. Few of those issues were extreme until the right wing started yapping about it over and over. Trans women have been in women's. Bathrooms since the 70s. People always believed a child's healthcare is between their parents and their doctors. Backlash against those are a vocal minority and also NEW

Everyone in power is happy when we're arguing about identity because then we're not talking about class

Have you been in a coma the last 5+ years or? Identity politics has never been less of a feature among liberals specifically because they want to "focus on class".

I don't think this works because then the right wing culture war just goes entirely unopposed

then they can dangle rights like a carrot on a string but when they're in power right executive orders that are basically strongly written letters.

I don't think this works either. I guess you are talking about Biden being opposed by a conservative legislature/courts, but LGBT people have more rights and anti-discrimination protections in liberal controlled states (and nations) than in conservative ones. Just a fact. Nobody is trying to "dangle rights on a string" for <1% of the population that mostly clusters in cities anyway. Trans people are vulnerable specifically because they are electorally irrelevant outside of maybe the gayest possible districts in some cities or whatever.

Never said I was right wing but thanks for proving my point.

lol every conservacuck has this canned reply

Not proving me wrong here. But keep telling yourself that, it's worked really well so far. Don't listen to the people you claim to want to have sway over, just tell them that they're heckin evil for not offering their perspective. That's exactly how you'll stop being universally disliked.
Not a conservative but thanks for proving my point once again.

No, thank YOU for proving MY point!

A decade ago people were open to discourse on them, trannies said "no compromise we get what we want or you're a transphobe" , they allowed and proctected extreme views from within their own community that they didn't agree with, and now the vast majority of people do not like them.

Uhhh yeah people do not like trannies because of a right wing propaganda campaign. There are "no compromise" people all over the political spectrum representing all minorities and majorities. You can say the exact same shit for LGB people too. Trans people used the bathroom since forever.

The main difference is that there is a right wing propaganda campaign against transgender people.

you're a victim of your own actions

Again, people who know a tranas person are LESS transphobic. YOU are a victim of right wing propaganda

say that people dislike trannies because they refuse to engage with people and call everyone that disagree with them evil

"Nooooooooo you're just a stinky poo poo and also you're evil!"

You're losing, you're wrong. You can keep telling yourself this and keep losing or you can start listening to people.

someone disagrees with you

"heh this just proves my point!"

reddit's that way

Gay people were "losing" in 2004 too.
Social conservatives keep losing since trans people are not going to stop existing. And knowing trans people encourages more support and sympathy for them. Your entire anti-trans push right now depends on constant social media spam for schizoid chuds with zero real world experience.

It was better when we were seen as just eccentric little freaks

Tbh I think the only reason trans hate is this big is because people are honestly sick of hearing about it. You've already had a lot of rights for awhile prior, you were just uninsured. Now insurances are covering procedures as well as HRT. People on the outside feel like there's no more to the movement other than forcing people to respect you, which gets very annoying very quickly. People don't necessarily hate trans people, the average person is just sick of the activists.

You're free to disagree with me but if I say that trannies ignore what is said and cope by making up strawman and then they immediately reply to my post calling me a conservative/rightwing/chud then guess what, you've proven my point.
Also, "dude reddit" is once again another example of proving my point.
I am not anti-trans. That is sometihng you made up. You made it up because you're obnoxious and unsubstantive. You keep telling yourself whatever you like, you're losing and you're going to keep on losing because you are completely incapable of basic engagement with anyone who isn't your echo.

So, indulge me here: If the trans movement collectively decides to concede on banning gender affirming care for minors, access to bathrooms, and gendered spaces of people of the same gender, and competing in sports with people of the same gender, what do you think will happen?

That all animosity, prejudice and legal challenges to trans people would vanish because reasonable people like you have been satisfied?

You are claiming transphobia exists because trannies "didn't allow for any discussions on using the bathroom"

You are anti-trans.

you're free to disagree me

btw everyone who disagrees with me is just ignoring muh argument

If this was reddit I'd downvote his ass with all 500 of my alts

No. I think it will take a very long time to repair the damage that 2014-2016 and the direction since has done to trannies' image.
I think that if back then trannies had compromised and argued for gender affirming care being available to minors given parental permission and a diagnosis, gender neutral bathrooms, no trannies in women's sports and accepting that it is appropriate for a trans person to disclose that they are trans before engaging with sex, things would be incredibly different today.
The movement fostered the animosity towards them far more so than any right-wing propaganda. They did it by using fascist tactics and protecting and enabling terrible people with terrible opinions.
I think the best thing trannies can do right now is shut the fuck up and focus on policing their own community and image.
I am claiming that and I am correct. You saying that I am anti-trans because of it only proves me right.
Thanks for proving my point.

In 2014-2016, gender affirming care for minors had not been banned in any US state, and had been available for years at that point. And in the exact same way it is still available in half of US states, which is under the supervision of doctors.

You’re saying that the trans movement should have campaigned for anti-trans laws, because not doing that then led to a more severe backlash later.

Anon Babble pre-Trump was actually kinda neat
there still is lmao we have chasergen for a reason

Anon Babble was pretty trans positive back then but mostly because they saw us as a luxury kind of porn or because there eas sort of a joint understanding that everyone on Anon Babble were failed males in one way or another.

Anon Babble overall was more left wing back then. You of course had edge lords, but a lot of them were very obviously only being edgy for the sake of it or general misanthropy instead of out of genuine deep-seated vitriolic hatred for specific groups. There were exceptions to this, of course, and they actually pissed moot off on many occasions.

Have you been in a coma the last 5+ years or? Identity politics has never been less of a feature among liberals specifically because they want to "focus on class".

Have you? Dems talk about class the same way Republicans do. They meander on and on about doing everything they can to preserve a so-called "middle class." Look at anything Harris said. She actually ceded a lot of ground to come off as less economically hawkish and appeal to the "middle class" in a lot of the same ways as Trump. The only big name politician who really talks about class is Bernie and the DNC specifically held him down when he ran in the primaries. Democratic voters want the party to talk about and care about actual class issues (owners vs workers), but the party is actively avoiding having to do that because it doesn't want to threaten the graces of its sponsors.

I'm saying that that should have been where they drew the line. Instead they pushed for having kids removed from their parents and let absolute creatures talk about how they're coming for people's kids and there's nothing they can do.
My point is, as I've said, that trannies created this atmosphere. Imagine undoing decades of progress in a couple of years because some white women (who would later turn on you) told you that being obnoxious is how you get what you want.
Trannies have no good will because they foster none. I am a normal person. I interract with normal people. I see that side of it. I know for a fact those people don't dislike trannies because of right-wing propaganda or whatever trannies want to tell themselves. They dislike trannies because of how trannies have allowed their movement to present itself.
Even now explaining to you people why expecting societal conscientiousness in regards to your gender identity while militantly disregaridng the feelings of other's when you say that the idea of wanting trannies to disclose they're trannies before engaging in sex is ridiculous, invalid or otherwise not your problem is incredibly hypocritical is like pulling teeth. The worst part is knowing that the number of trans people who have had SRS and pass enough to stealthily have sex with someone is so incredibly low. But that's a good summary of the trans movement. You'll argue for things you don''t agree with, or that affect so few people, because you've been conditioned to believe that anyone who disagrees with you is "ontologically evil".
The grand irony is that you're able to identify these exact flaws within chuds and then you just make the same mistakes yourself. Which in and of itself is one of their flaws.

You're utterly delulu, sister, and this is what everyone has been telling you, even showing evidence for. You keep ceding ground when someone shows evidence that counters whatever nonsense and lies you're saying, but you can't seem to accept that the central premise that these lies affirm is false: that trans people somehow brought all their problems on themselves. It's frankly a ridiculous idea from the get go, but the fact that you can be shown all this evidence agaimst it and still hold on to it is kinda sad. But go off I guess, queen.

even if he has drunk the kool aid a little hes right about almost everything except the fact that trans people did it to themselves: the spokespersons for the movement are overwhelmingly fake trans. AGP rapehons, theyfab trenders, etc.

Dems have been going further and further left on economic issues, while decentering identity politics more and more. Bill Clinton was all about gutting welfare and he dominated the white working class because of it. Biden was all about boosting manufacturing and unions and flopped because of that.

Its all culture war

BERNIE!!

If Bernie is the only politician who talks about class then what does that tell you about the people who are getting elected? Is it because nobody is as smart as Bernie is?

They did. Being obnoxious and catty isn't an argument. I haven't ceded any ground and no evidence to the contrary of what I've said has been provided.
Again I am offering free perspective, I don't care if you choose to continue to delude yourself and live in ignorance.
Your whole mindset is so coloured by it that it is kind of sad that you don't see it. You don't care what I say, you simply want to pin on me whatever suits you and whatever silences the disagreement. You have no interest in encouraging people to like you, to listening to people's concerns, you know any of the things that would actually help your position. Instead you're mind is rotten with this weird reddit mindset where you think everyone who disagrees with you is your enemy and all that matters is proving me wrong even when that is not possible.
So keep patting yourself on the back, I really don't care, you're literally just practicing exactly what I'm telling you you're practicing.
Another cope. And another one that makes trans people look bad. I don't get why it is so hard for you to admit that trannies can just be shitty people. Especially a group that is defined by a mental illness and decades of targeted oppression. Face it, identity politics gave trannies a taste of some power and a lot of them abused it. Most people are just retarded and bad. Most people don't think of anything deeply. HRT for minors for most trannies means "I would totally not be a hon if I had this". Trannies participating in women's sports is "well nothing else matters because if you say no you're saying we're not women".
This idea that people have "drunk the kool aid" is ridiculous. There's no kool aid. There is no manipulation because there doesn't need to be. You can just shine a light on trannies and that is enough because your entire approach is so fucking awful.
Again the solution is simple. Shut up, be good people, police your community.

damn you're a retarded nigger. I try policing my community by identifying outsiders and you tell me shut up and police your community! nevermind kill yourself i hope you get deported illiterate spic

I find it funny that you keep steering the conversation back to how trans people need to disclose that they’re trans beforehand to sexual partners. Especially because you felt the need to add that most trans people are visibly trans. If it’s that easy to spot them, why is it so important they be so forthright about it? This is a very specific complaint. Like you’re bitter about having sex with a transwoman who didn’t tell you she was trans beforehand, and you didn’t know until after you had sex with her.

Especially since the main legal issue relating to adult trans people having sex is less lenient criminal penalties for committing violence against a trans person when you feel ashamed of finding them attractive or having sex with them when you didn’t know they were trans.

As for the whole “they’re coming for your kids” narrative, that’s mostly laws and rulings regarding custody disputes where one parent does not want their child to transition when it’s demonstrably medically necessary for the child in question. Which, again, this only happens in states where gender affirming care for minors is legal and overseen by doctors. What you’re defending is a parent’s right to decide what is medically necessary for their children based on their personal views, and specifically for parents who don’t want their child to transition to have more say than a parent of the same child who supports what their child and their child’s doctors want.

You say this is about the reasonable views of average people and not the influence of right wing propaganda on public opinion, but also that trans people are to blame for situations where right wingers can make transgender rights sound bad.

I haven't ceded any ground and no evidence to the contrary of what I've said has been provided.

You're right, I actually gave you too much credit in saying you ceded any ground. You refuse to admit when you're wrong and instead change the subject or move the goalpost when evidence is presented against you.

claim: familiarity with trannies causes contempt for them

refutation: poll showing the opposite is true

recourse: quietly ignore original claim and say trannies have brought hate on themselves

claim: trans people petitioning for healthcare for children alienates trans people

refutation: trans youth have always had healthcare until recently due to conservative lobbying

recourse: umm well actually that doesn't prove me wrong and you're part of the reason why trannies are so hated

irrelevant whining about being hated and "straw manned" (look up the meaning of that word please) for preaching your truth

Please grow up.

ACKSHUALLY in early/mid 20th century stuff u can see they did misgender trannies (anyone who says this as an entire post is a retarded redditor who takes everything literally tho) BUT culturally yes i 100% agree with you, most of this is astroturfed and formed a membrane into the retarded aesthetics culture war, it really goes to show how boomers dont even remember the old world theyre trying to preserve lol. were doctors trying to shock therapy us? yes but thats a psychiatry thing not a society thing, trannies were still treated like a minority but if you were surrounded by grown adults with some degree of mental maturity as a twinkhon or higher post-srs in 2002 you'd on average prolly just get hit by a -20% wage gap and not much more. which still sucks ASS but like 100x better than what we have rn

4ch got invaded by reddit in like 2015-16 or so i forget which caused it being right-wing so i just percieve it as a different site outside of enclosed gens/boards since its a totally different userbase.

can anyone post that one old Anon Babble comic of a trans girl though? it was actually nice i miss it

man i miss when Anon Babble was lgbt and didnt have you fucks shitting it up 24/7. kill yourself